In this podcast episode, the host interviews guest Gary Taubes about his background in physics and journalism. Taubes discusses his transition from physics to journalism, including his interest in investigative reporting, which led him to write about the Shroud of Turin. He also shares his experience as a boxer, emphasizing the importance of skepticism and critical thinking in both science and journalism. The conversation then moves on to the challenges of conducting scientific experiments, including the need for rigorous testing of hypotheses and the importance of controlling for biases. Taubes discusses his investigative journalism on the controversies surrounding nutrition science and the history of obesity research. He challenges the energy balance hypothesis of obesity and suggests a hormonal regulatory disorder focusing on insulin instead. The discussion ends with a call for unbiased scientists to form teams to address the obesity and diabetes epidemics, and a focus on policy changes to make foods less palatable and more healthy.